Deepfakes

mammos

Administrator
Hey guys. Just a little discussion here to get this board a bit alive!

What is your opinion in regards to deepfakes? Having recently seen the Tom Cruise ones where IMO are the best deepfakes I have ever seen, how do you see the deepfake "trend" moving into mainstream movies? I mean, imagine the Tom Cruise one which you can barely (if you can) spot that he is not the real Tom, moving into Hollywood and then adding some "sorcery" by VFX specialists, I'm pretty sure that they can make an actor/actress "do what they want", without even them participating in the scene(s) and you would never know the difference, unless it is clearly stated by the production team.

About explicit/unsimulated scenes, the closest to the technology that I can recall being used; although not using deepfakes, was Nymphomaniac. They can just deepfake famous actresses into explicit scenes, without compromising their integrity since they won't be the ones participating in the scene in reality. How would that make you feel? For me, it would definitely look awesome, but at the same time, I feel that it would not "satisfy" me so to say, because at the back of my head I would know she really isn't the one involved in the scene. It will be as if an advanced body double is being used.

What are your thoughts?
 

tng

Well-Known Member
It's definitely going to happen more and more. I could see actor unions forcing the hands of big studios on this issue once the technology is fully fleshed out and super cheap, especially after the #MeToo movement. Which is great for actors, you want them to be as comfortable as they are willing to be and this is a great compromise. It could potentially lead to more sexual content in movies/TV, where the filmmakers are not scared to include nudity in their scripts and where actors are not scared to accept such roles.

And at that point it's going to be to us to accept this new reality or cry about it, because what else can we do? Once we can't tell the difference, you'll always have a doubt. Real or not, even if they tell you it's real, you won't believe it and if they tell you it's fake, you might think they say that to save their faces (Blue is the Warmest Colour).

The big studio productions will most certainly be affected by this sooner rather than later, but thankfully, we'll always have daring filmmakers and actors who are willing to go the extramile.
 

mammos

Administrator
but thankfully, we'll always have daring filmmakers and actors who are willing to go the extramile.

Will we though? I mean, if such technology will be available, why won't they just take the "safe" road?
 

tng

Well-Known Member
Will we though? I mean, if such technology will be available, why won't they just take the "safe" road?
On the independent side of the film industry? Totally. We are in that situation right now; why would any actors want to have real sex on screen when there's already a million ways to trick the viewers if they wanted to, but you still have actors willing to go all in. Independent filmmakers and actors are artists to the core, they want to bend the rules and when deepfakes become the standard for Hollywood, the indy scene will be more than happy to brag about how real their movies are.

But is it really going to be real? Who knows at that point, are you only going to be satisfied if the movie comes with a 2 hours behind the scenes documentary, will they deepfake that one? At some point you have to draw a line somewhere or you won't believe anything ever again. Nymphomaniac is the best example for that, I firmly believe that most scenes with Stacy Martin are really her and not some CGI-Deepfake, the double penetration scene with Charlotte Gainsbourg looks so fake it's almost funny to look at, the scenes with Stacy are perfectly lit, no weird blocking, they look real. Is it, is it not? I don't care, my brain told me it's good enough to be real and that's good enough for me. If it's truly fake then I won't ever have a problem with deepfakes if it's done that well.
 

sowbb

Moderator
The deep fakes, IMHO, will replace today's prosthetics scenes, not the real unsimulated arthouse scenes. Why? Because filmmakers and actors that do those scenes do it not for the sake of good visuals but for the sake of real authenticity and edginess. 99.99% of the real and explicit scenes today could had been done in a non-explicit manner, but the filmmakers etc. chose to go the extra mile for various reasons. That won't change with deep fakes as they are just better CGI effects, another tool in the director's toolkit.

Think about erotic (non-explicit) movies from the 70's - the technology at that time made those scenes harder to fake than today, but they were faked nonetheless. Those who didn't fake it did it usually to prove a point. Today (pre-deep-fakes) it's much easier to fake those scenes, which spark a lot of "did they or didn't they" debates here, but we still get the rare unsimulated film. The only difference is that we get more scenes, some of them are fake but we let them pass out of doubt.

We all forget that all movies are just pixels on a screen. If deep fakes generate the exact same pixels, is there a difference? Say, in the deep fake era, we get to see a really famous actress going the extra mile: whether she confirms or denies it was her, some of us will always scream fake, as tng said, but how is it different than today? It's not like such a transition didn't happen before: when real sex was first shown at the cinema, people that were used to seeing the real thing at the theater probably had a rough time accepting the grainy images as "real". And when VHS was invented, it took the porn-movie theaters a long time to die for the same reasons.

I do disagree, however, that deep fakes will make "pseudo-unsimulated" scenes common. Most actresses care more about people thinking they did it for real than actually doing it. Think "blue is the warmest color". Another good example is "Alice in Wonderland" with Kristine DeBell: I read somewhere that most of her scenes were faked using BDs except for the BJ scene - she did it with her the BF director (?), outside of the set, not knowing it would be included in the film. Although her HC scenes didn't actually include her, she still (rightfully!) screamed bloody murder. A more recent example is "London Fields": it was stuck in courts for about a decade because the director filmed HC scenes with a BD for Tara Reid, and she sued because "people might think it's her". She won: the (awful) released version is a rough recut and the HC scenes are not to be shown. Ever. When deep fakes will actually be able to serve as a virtual BDs, the Actors Guild will simply forbit using them without actress consent (btw, I think it already does).
 

tng

Well-Known Member
I do disagree, however, that deep fakes will make "pseudo-unsimulated" scenes common. Most actresses care more about people thinking they did it for real than actually doing it. Think "blue is the warmest color". Another good example is "Alice in Wonderland" with Kristine DeBell: I read somewhere that most of her scenes were faked using BDs except for the BJ scene - she did it with her the BF director (?), outside of the set, not knowing it would be included in the film. Although her HC scenes didn't actually include her, she still (rightfully!) screamed bloody murder. A more recent example is "London Fields": it was stuck in courts for about a decade because the director filmed HC scenes with a BD for Tara Reid, and she sued because "people might think it's her". She won: the (awful) released version is a rough recut and the HC scenes are not to be shown. Ever. When deep fakes will actually be able to serve as a virtual BDs, the Actors Guild will simply forbit using them without actress consent (btw, I think it already does).
For my part I was talking that it might lead to more nudity in general, not unsimulated scenes. That ship is long gone for big studio productions. But it might make some actresses remove their non-nudity clause if they don't have to do the nudity themselves. Maybe the days of sex scenes with bras on in bed will finally be over!
 

GrumpeeCat

New Member
To me, the greatest technological breakthrough will be the day we can enter a porn site and choose a celebrity's face and body, a scenario and plot the scene the way we want it, all in Virtual Reality/POV!!! To me that would be the Nirvana of masturbation!!! You simple choose your fapping goddess, and you either fuck her yourself or choose another character to fuck her, and enjoy the view!!!
 
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